merlinofchaos: (Default)
merlinofchaos ([personal profile] merlinofchaos) wrote2003-05-05 01:49 pm

Words to Live By

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."
-- Benjamin Franklin, 1759

[identity profile] jakeaidan.livejournal.com 2003-05-05 02:38 pm (UTC)(link)
What is an "essential liberty"?

Re: Ben's not here to answer that...

[identity profile] jakeaidan.livejournal.com 2003-05-05 02:51 pm (UTC)(link)
I've always agreed with Alexander Hamilton's view on the Bill of Rights...which is to say that it's a travesty. Hamilton argued, correctly I think, that making a Bill of Rights indicates things not listed in the Bill of Rights aren't guaranteed rights. He was right, we now source only the right guaranteed to us by legislation, instead of possessing all rights, except those denied by specific legislation.
I think all liberties are essential, because each liberty has specific meaning to the individual, if not the rest of the world.

Re: Ben's not here to answer that...

[identity profile] tersa.livejournal.com 2003-05-05 03:48 pm (UTC)(link)
Of course, the real irony about it all is that the Founding Fathers themselves were surprised at the need to make a Bill of Rights. Many of them shared Hamilton's opinion, to a point, of thinking it was "Like, duh", and didn't need it written down.

I wonder if anyone has done an in-depth analysis of the help and harm those first ten amendments have had on the shape of our country as it is today, theoretically speaking.

Re: Ben's not here to answer that...

[identity profile] jakeaidan.livejournal.com 2003-05-05 04:42 pm (UTC)(link)
I think there is something to be said for making a system where everything is allowed except that which is specifically excluded. Otherwise, when you run into a grey area...there's subjectivity.
People yell about their rights a great deal, but what it really boils down to is what are you NOT allowed to do.
For instance...I have "Freedom of Speech"....but I don't really...because laws have been passed limiting my freedom of speech. I can't make a sexist joke at the workplace. There is a law forbidding it. So, really, what does the "Freedom of Speech" give me. It gives me the freedom to speak, save where it is in violation of the law. If I wasn't given that right...I'd still have the freedom to speak, except where violated by law.

[identity profile] tyee.livejournal.com 2003-05-05 09:32 pm (UTC)(link)
One of my favorite t-shirts has that quote!